And now, your moment of Buddy Rich

"ttyymmnn" (ttyymmnn)
08/10/2020 at 12:35 • Filed to: None

DISCUSSION (19)

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > ttyymmnn
08/10/2020 at 12:42

Damn. Dude’s got chops. I liked how the band knew just when the riff was over. That’s musicianship. And he’s sweating like a stuck pig when he’s finished.

ttyymmnn > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/10/2020 at 12:45

One of the all-time greats. Rich has a reputation for being an arrogant a**hole, and it is well earned. However, I think it’s more complicated than his simply being a jerk. Clearly, he’s extraordinarily talented, and that can certainly breed arrogance, but he also has zero time for anybody who doesn’t take the art as seriously as he does. If he felt like you were slacking, or not playing up to his extremely high standard, he’d let you know. There are famous recordings, probably on youtube, of him berating his band. But I don’t think any of them took it personally.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > ttyymmnn
08/10/2020 at 13:46

Do any young drummers coming up use traditional grips any more?

Darkbrador > ttyymmnn
08/10/2020 at 13:53

It’s a little known fact that Quasimodo was also an excellent drummer ...

Bob Loblaw Made Me Make a Phoney Phone Call to Edward Rooney > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
08/10/2020 at 14:08

Absolutely, with the exception that even the worst human being among them isn’t half the arrogant asshole that Buddy Rich was. Just about anyone who can hang in a jam session today can play both matched and traditional, knows there’s a time and a place for each, and switches back and forth as necessary. Nate Smith below is the big name du jour in drumming these days and switches between each incessantly.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Bob Loblaw Made Me Make a Phoney Phone Call to Edward Rooney
08/10/2020 at 14:11

So, is traditional still taught first to young drummers just starting off?

Bob Loblaw Made Me Make a Phoney Phone Call to Edward Rooney > ttyymmnn
08/10/2020 at 14:11

My hot take: Buddy Rich was just the predecessor to blast beats, treating the drums like sport not art, and that he continues to overshadow the pantheon of vastly more interesting and musical drummers of his time is a blight on the entire concept of Western music .

There may be a touch of hyperbole in the above.

Bob Loblaw Made Me Make a Phoney Phone Call to Edward Rooney > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
08/10/2020 at 14:15

I think that depends on how you come up. Those who come up in an academic band/ drumline environment will absolutely learn both, as each has an appropriate use within that context depending on what you’re playing. If you learn through a non-academic drum teacher, I think it’s a crapshoot as to what they teach; neither of my teachers growing up emphasized traditional grip, they just wanted me to use what felt comfortable and refine what I brought in from being self-taught . If you’re self taught, most gravitate towards matched (certainly as rock music blasting youths) , but since picking the drums back up after a 10 year hiatus I’ve been relearning with a traditional grip.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Bob Loblaw Made Me Make a Phoney Phone Call to Edward Rooney
08/10/2020 at 14:30

That’s cool that you’re getting back into it.

I played piano for many years as a kid, but have lost pretty much all of it, sadly.

McMike > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
08/10/2020 at 14:30

He looked up and cued the band in @7:46 when there was one more bar left, and counted them in with four large snare hits during that last fill.

It’s subtle , but they had plenty of warning. :)

ttyymmnn > Bob Loblaw Made Me Make a Phoney Phone Call to Edward Rooney
08/10/2020 at 14:46

Buddy Rich was an arrogant asshole, but I think it’s a little bit more complicated than that. In my own opinion, I think he was an extraordinary talent who worked extremely hard and took his craft very seriously, but had no time (or even utter contempt) for anybody he didn’t feel was pulling his weight or taking it as seriously as he was. That whole Carson interview is quite good (Johnny introduces him as “Mr. Humble,” which is hilarious).

ttyymmnn > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
08/10/2020 at 14:48

Bob Loblaw gave a better explanation than I ever could have. But I do think it boils down to how you are taught and by whom. I believe that kids coming up through school band programs are taught traditional, as are classically trained percussionists. If you start out playing in a garage band, you’ll probably learn match grip. I played a gig many years ago with Charlie Daniels, and his drummer, who was absolutely phenomenal, played traditional.

ttyymmnn > Bob Loblaw Made Me Make a Phoney Phone Call to Edward Rooney
08/10/2020 at 14:51

And I’d also add, though, that I’ve worked with many truly phenomenal, dedicated, hard working musicians who weren’t arrogant assholes, or were arrogant without the asshole part. At that level of talent, arrogance often is part and parcel with the person. But one of the greatest trumpet players I’ve ever known, Ray Crisara, was also one of the humblest, kindest, and most caring people I have ever met. And if you studied with him, as I did, you would find that every member of his studio was equally humble and kind. It came from the top.

ttyymmnn > Bob Loblaw Made Me Make a Phoney Phone Call to Edward Rooney
08/10/2020 at 14:58

I can see that. Many years ago, I was teaching at a local high school and I had a blind student who idolized Wynton Marsalis. When the Lincoln Center group came to town, my student got to go to the concert, and not only met Wynton but got to play for him. I saw the student the next day, and he was walking on cloud nine. I asked him what Wynton told him, and the student said, “He said my playing has soul .” I asked him if he knew what Wynton meant, and he said he didn’t . I told him , “I think it means that he hears you when you play. He hears you in your sound.” That may well be a similar deal with Rich. He was an unabashedly brash and outspoken man (which may be a generous description ) , and you clearly heard that “I’m the center of the universe” attitude in his playing. Which is fine if it’s his band. That didn’t take away from his ability or musicianship. You were just hearing him in his playing.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > ttyymmnn
08/10/2020 at 15:14

Like a coach.

You can get similar results from players by fear, or by love...

Some only know how to deal in fear, sadly.

ttyymmnn > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
08/10/2020 at 15:18

But it also wasn’t gold stars and pats on the back. If you came into your lesson and played your music perfectly, that’s nothing more than what you should be doing. One of the greatest compliments I ever got from him in a lesson was when I played my whole etude down without stopping, and he said, “Tim, a lright, I think. ” Then he reached up and turned the page. That was it, but I knew I had nailed it.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > ttyymmnn
08/10/2020 at 15:22

High expectations.

I had a design professor in college that I really had to work hard to get a response from her that my work wasn’t “crap”. She wasn’t abusive, but expected the best and told the truth.

Makes me think of the kids who went on American Idol because their family & friends had always told them they were great singers, only to learn very quickly that everyone had been lying to them their whole life.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > McMike
08/10/2020 at 15:27

And there ya’ have it. I see it now that you point it out. Plus they’d probably rehearsed and that stage band would be top shelf and would probably have a sense of when the cue would come. At least Doc would’ve...

ttyymmnn > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
08/10/2020 at 15:33

High expectations, high standards, basically professional standards. Basically saying, if you want a job in this business, you have to play this way all the time. Crisara came up as one of the leading studio calls in NYC during the 50s-70s. You might only get one shot at something, so it’d better be right the first time.